'80s Movie Montage
Breaking down our favorite decade of flicks. Hosted by Anna Keizer and Derek Dehanke.
'80s Movie Montage
First Blood
In this episode, Anna and Derek discuss Teasle's massive dickishness, the dichotomy between this film and the rest of the franchise, and much more during their chat of the Sylvester Stallone starrer First Blood (1982).
Connect with '80s Movie Montage on Facebook, Twitter/X or Instagram! It's the same handle for all three... @80smontagepod.
Anna Keizer and Derek Dehanke are the co-hosts of ‘80s Movie Montage. The idea for the podcast came when they realized just how much they talk – a lot – when watching films from their favorite cinematic era. Their wedding theme was “a light nod to the ‘80s,” so there’s that, too. Both hail from the Midwest but have called Los Angeles home for several years now. Anna is a writer who received her B.A. in Film/Video from Columbia College Chicago and M.A. in Film Studies from Chapman University. Her dark comedy short She Had It Coming was an Official Selection of 25 film festivals with several awards won for it among them. Derek is an attorney who also likes movies. It is a point of pride that most of their podcast episodes are longer than the movies they cover.
All I wanted was something to eat. But the man kept pushing, sir. Well, you did some pushing of your own, John. They drew first blood, not me. Look, Johnny. Let me come in and get you the hell out of there. They drew first blood.
SPEAKER_02:Hello and welcome to 80s Movie Montage. This is Derek.
SPEAKER_01:And this is Anna.
SPEAKER_02:And that was Sylvester Stallone saying the name of the movie twice. Correct. And of course, that is 1982's They Drew First Blood. But it's just First Blood. Just First Blood, yeah. If you would think that the title could have been They Drew First Blood. But it's just First Blood.
SPEAKER_01:It is. Yeah. And... This is, what, the second time we've brought up Sylvester Stallone?
SPEAKER_02:I think we brought up one. It was like a fighting movie or something that he was in.
SPEAKER_01:And this is his other... Like, he has multiple franchises that
SPEAKER_02:he
SPEAKER_01:is behind, and this is probably the second most famous. Rocky for sure is the first.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, this was the first non-Rocky movie to not be kind of like a box office disappointment.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, and we'll definitely... Oh, yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:There was some crossover.
SPEAKER_01:In season three.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, we talked about some other Rockies, I think, didn't we? We
SPEAKER_01:did, because we made the decision that four was probably a little bit more fun to talk about than three. Yeah. But three kind of got rolled into that conversation, and da-da-da-da-da. In any case, first blood! So, I think you just said 1982. Yeah. I did. It's pretty early on in the decade. And let's jump in. So, I did not know this. I think you also said that you did not know this, that it is based on a novel.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I don't think I... It makes sense because it's so different from all of the sequels. And, I mean, just getting it right out of the way, although the book and the movie tracked in some respects in the book... Well, let me take a step back. In the movie, he kind of goes out of his way to not kill people. The one guy that died slipped out of the helicopter. Otherwise, he's wounding to get them off his back. In the book, he was straight up just murdering folks. And also, at the end of the
SPEAKER_01:book,
SPEAKER_02:Colonel Trotman shoots him in the head before he can kill
SPEAKER_01:Teasel. Very different kind of ending, and hence would have ended the possibility of a franchise. It's so much
SPEAKER_02:tougher. I can't stress enough how much more difficult it is to have sequels when the main character is shot in the head. The Kingsman did it.
SPEAKER_01:Oh, because of Colin Firth. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:But yeah, so that was one like really significant change, but it also kind of makes sense how the character morphed into something that went like way beyond what the original novel intended.
SPEAKER_01:It became a caricature of itself.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. It's kind of sad because the first movie is... It has its ridiculous moments for sure, but it's not glorifying violence in the way that the sequels basically do.
SPEAKER_01:Sure, sure. And it is a really interesting film. I mean, we'll get into the story, but to start with the writers. So I had mentioned the fact that it was based on a novel because we're going to bring up that gentleman first. His name is David... I'm going to say morale.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_01:Moral. Morale. So as far as IMDb is concerned, he has 33 writing credits, but 23 of them can all be tied back to first blood. Okay. But to your point, it's because it became such a successful franchise that he was, you know, like grandfathered into all this because he originated the material. Yeah. That is David. He has
SPEAKER_02:actually said that he prefers, as far as like the first movie versus his book, he prefers the movie.
SPEAKER_01:Interesting. Which
SPEAKER_02:is a smart thing for him to say.
SPEAKER_01:Stephen King has said that on occasion about a couple of his. Has
SPEAKER_02:he really?
SPEAKER_01:I think he said... Oh, man. What's it going to be for? Well, like... I want to say, no, I don't think it was It, but I think he really liked Stand By Me.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, yeah. That makes sense. Shawshank, maybe.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Okay. Like those properties. So this isn't fair to David Morrell because I highly doubt he had anything to do with some of those properties that were, we'll say, inspired by Rambo or First Blood. Mm-hmm. But I had to bring some of them up because they're so funny. Okay. I'm kind of surprised they're listed in IMDb. But under some of his credits, we have Rambo.
SPEAKER_02:No way.
SPEAKER_01:Which is a video.
SPEAKER_02:No way. Come
SPEAKER_01:on. Rambo, colon, the sex platoon.
SPEAKER_02:Wait, the what now?
SPEAKER_01:The sex platoon.
SPEAKER_02:Ah, okay. Okay.
SPEAKER_01:And then we also have... Rambone.
SPEAKER_02:Rambone.
SPEAKER_01:Triple X.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_01:Colon. A Dream Zone parody.
SPEAKER_02:Do you even need all the subtext here when it's called Rambone? I feel like we kind of get where it's going. So
SPEAKER_01:I just thought that those were really funny. And then the outlier to all this like First Blood and Rambo stuff. He also... There was a TV miniseries called Brotherhood of the Rose, which was based on another of his novels.
SPEAKER_02:Okay. Okay. All right.
SPEAKER_01:All right. Moving on. Now, we have four individuals to talk about as far as writing credits go. So, Morel, he wrote the book. And then I want to say that these two guys, they worked together on probably the initial screenplay. First of which, Michael Cazale.
UNKNOWN:Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_01:So he has a screenplay by credit. Some of his credits include... I think he worked primarily in television, but also... Like was a producer. And one of them is a very prominent show. So he wrote on, these are all TV properties, Switch, Quincy M.E., and Del Vecchio, I think is the way that you would say that. Is that right or no?
SPEAKER_02:I don't know. I know Quincy. I'm familiar with the Quincy show. Yeah. It was like a CSI, like a detective. Was it? Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Okay, but do you say DeVecchio?
SPEAKER_02:I don't know. Is that how you say it? All I can say is I know Quincy. That's it. Okay.
SPEAKER_01:Well, you also know this one. He created the show Hill Street Blues.
SPEAKER_02:I'm familiar with that show, even though I never watched a single episode. Well,
SPEAKER_01:that was a little bit before. Yeah,
SPEAKER_02:I know what it is, though. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:So that is Michael Cosell. And then the other gentleman who I think partnered with him on this, William Sackheim.
SPEAKER_02:So
SPEAKER_01:he also has a screenplay by credit. And some of his other credits, I have actually almost all films. They're kind of cute. So one is called Let's Go Steady.
SPEAKER_02:That's very innocent. Very wholesome. Very wholesome.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. My Dog Rusty.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_01:This one, it's a film called Smart Girls Don't Talk.
UNKNOWN:Okay.
SPEAKER_01:So take that for what you will. And then he also wrote on the TV show that I am referring to as Delvecchio.
SPEAKER_02:Delvecchio.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_01:Okay. So the last person who has a writing credit is actually Sylvester Stallone himself.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, yeah. I've heard of that guy.
SPEAKER_01:And I'm curious if people realize how involved he is. often is in the writing process with a lot of the films that he does. So people obviously know him as this huge movie star, both in like, well, mostly action movies, I guess maybe first of all, it's a little bit adventure.
SPEAKER_02:It's kind of...
SPEAKER_01:First of all,
SPEAKER_02:I mean, it for sure has a lot of action elements. The guy basically single-handedly destroys a whole town, for God's sake. Yeah. It's, I think, intended to have some other elements added in.
SPEAKER_01:He doesn't mean... Only meaning that's usually the genre he gravitates towards, although he has done more straight dramatic work, like Copland, I know he got a lot of attention for.
SPEAKER_02:He has, yeah. Isn't there a documentary or something about him and... There is.
SPEAKER_01:Well, it's not about the both of them. They each came out with their own.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, really? Yeah. Okay. But that's... In any case, that's one of the things that I... like often think of as like a distinguishing factor is how much more involved, directly involved Stallone is with a lot of his movies.
SPEAKER_01:The, so weird aside, I've watched both of them. Yeah. Uh, the Arnold one came out first. That actually is like a three part docu series because it correlates with like the different phases of his life. So like the first one is athlete. The second one is actor. And the third one is like political figure
SPEAKER_02:governor, the governator.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. And it's really good. It's, it's a really, really good docuseries. I was kind of hoping for a similar impression of the Sylvester Stallone documentary. It's just a single one, and I think it just tops out at a little bit over an hour, maybe. It's fine. It doesn't really go as deep as the Arnold one, but it is interesting. And I think from that, you do understand that he actually first... He always wanted to be an actor, but he first was a writer. Yeah. So... In any case, as far as his writing credits go, so he also has a screenplay by credit. Now, in total, at the moment, he has 46 writing credits. 29 of them relate to either the Rocky franchise, the First Blood franchise, or the Expendables franchise. Okay. But outside of those, I mean, he did get a Best Original Screenplay Oscar nomination for Rocky once.
SPEAKER_02:I definitely thought when you started with the R, I thought you were going for Rhinestone.
SPEAKER_01:Well, that's what I'm doing outside of like what I already, for the most part, brought up are like his really famous franchises. So other writing credits that he has are for Staying Alive.
SPEAKER_02:Really? Okay.
SPEAKER_01:You just mentioned it. Rhinestone, Cobra, Over the Top, which we could do all of these movies.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, we should. Why not?
SPEAKER_01:And then now we're getting into the 90s cliffhanger, which we were like, oh, is First Blood a cliffhanger prequel? Because he does, like, rock climbing.
SPEAKER_02:I mean, I kind of want it to be, but...
SPEAKER_01:Obviously not, but... And then, like I mentioned, he did Right on the Expendables and then Homefront. So don't worry. We're going to get back to Stallone in just a minute. But now we're moving on to Directed By. So gentleman's name, Ted Kochoff? Sure. is what I'm going to say that. Yeah. And so as far as, I think he is at this point retired. Among his credits, I have a little bit of TV, a little bit of film. So he directed on a TV series called Armchair Theater.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_01:So it's kind of fun.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:He directed the original 1977 Fun with Dick and Jane.
SPEAKER_02:Not the one with Jim Carrey.
SPEAKER_01:No, which actually is not a Bad movie. I don't know if I would really think of it to watch again, but I remember seeing it and thinking, like, this is fine.
SPEAKER_02:Okay. Sometimes fine is
SPEAKER_01:enough. This is fine. Yeah. I thought this was a fun film title. Who is Killing the Great Chefs of Europe? Oh, yeah. I would watch that. It's a movie title. Yeah. He directed Weekend at Bertie's. God damn it. Infamously. Infamously. Going back to television, he directed some episodes of Law& Order Special Victims Unit.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. SVU. Always a good time.
SPEAKER_01:This, I'm like, what is this about? We need to find this. He has a directing credit for what is titled as First Blood Colon Humorous Ending. What? I don't know what that is about, but I really want to find it.
SPEAKER_02:It's from 2014.
UNKNOWN:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:So obviously like a parody or spoof or...
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:But like what... I'm just curious like what they would have mocked up as the humorous ending.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:I don't... But he has a directing credit for it.
SPEAKER_02:All right. All right. Well, we're gonna have to look into that.
SPEAKER_01:And the reason why I think he's retired at this point, his last credit is Soul of an Artist, which was a film. So... Okay, moving on to cinematography. Andrew Laszlo is his name. And some really interesting credits to his name as well. I mean, definitely got his start. If I'm remembering correctly, when I first went over his bio, I think he was born in Europe around World War II, right? I want to say that he... Gosh, if I'm remembering correctly, I think he might have been the only one in his family who survived concentration camps. So am I right about that? I don't want to be right about that. But yeah, he was the sole member of his family to survive. So he emigrated... Let's see. Emigrated from Europe, immigrated to America in 1947. So he was working... for quite a while before this film came along. But some of his credits include, and I have mostly filmed some TV. There was a TV series called Naked City. I thought this was interesting because what was this used on as the closing production company credit? I think on different TV shows, he... shot a film called One Potato, Two Potato.
SPEAKER_02:So One Potato, Two Potato is what we often see after like some of the master, some of the Gordon Ramsay
SPEAKER_01:shows. That's what it is. Yeah. Huh. I wonder if there's a connection there. Okay. He shot the original film, The Out of Towners. He shot Love and Other Strangers. We were just with some wonderful friends last night and he was wearing a jersey in ode to the Warriors.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I'm so sad that that was 1979. That would be a really
SPEAKER_01:fun one. I thought so, yeah. And Laszlo shot that. He also, so this is a show that was recently came out and had a lot of popularity and I think has been greenlit for at least another season. But there was an original TV miniseries from 1980 called Shogun.
SPEAKER_02:Oh.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. I never know
SPEAKER_02:how to say it right.
SPEAKER_01:That's how I'm just choosing. Yeah, no, that's how... I don't think it's like Shogun. Shogun? No, I don't think so.
SPEAKER_02:But maybe it is. But the trailers or the commercials for the show basically reflect how you just said it.
SPEAKER_01:The first time I said it. Yeah, I'm
SPEAKER_02:assuming that's the right way to say it, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Got it. So he shot that. He also did... Didn't... Haven't you said you like this movie? He did Rima Williams' The Adventure Begins.
SPEAKER_02:We're definitely going to cover that movie. It is... Bonkers. Yeah. Yeah. We definitely got to do that one.
SPEAKER_01:He did. So he has some notable 80s flicks in particular. He did. I don't I don't know if we'll ever go back to this franchise. He did Poltergeist to the other side.
SPEAKER_02:That is a particularly tough one. to watch knowing what happened during the filming of it, right?
SPEAKER_01:Well, I think she passed during the third. The
SPEAKER_02:third one? Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Wow.
SPEAKER_02:Any of them are kind of tough knowing what's happened to not just her, but to other people involved in the film.
SPEAKER_01:To me, it's just such a drop off from the original film. Like the original film is just such a masterpiece. Yeah. I don't know if I even like am interested in, like, I know I've seen two and three at different times, but. Sure.
SPEAKER_02:But two is a great example of how you somehow made it less by trying to do more.
SPEAKER_01:Correct. Yes. I totally agree with you. He shot Interspace, Star Trek V, The Final Frontier.
SPEAKER_02:Gotta be honest, not one of my favorites. Okay. Not a huge fan. It's better than The Undiscovered Country, for God's sake.
SPEAKER_01:Okay. He also infamously shot Ghost Dad.
SPEAKER_02:Okay. Much to my eternal shame, gotta clear my throat, I saw that movie in the theater. I don't even know why.
SPEAKER_01:I've never seen it.
SPEAKER_02:Why would I have seen it?
SPEAKER_01:I don't judge you for seeing it.
SPEAKER_02:Pretty sure I saw Leonard Part 6 in the theater, too. Whoa. But it was probably like a dollar movie kind of thing. Sure. Arizona, just want to get out of the heat. Sure. In retrospect, I think I would have rather just had heat exhaustion.
SPEAKER_01:Nobody knew. We didn't know.
SPEAKER_02:But
SPEAKER_01:at the time,
SPEAKER_02:at the time, even we didn't know they were still really bad. And
SPEAKER_01:then he's no longer with us because he was like born in 1926. But his final credit was Newsies.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, yeah. My favorite. My favorite kind of hat.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, it is your favorite kind of hat. All right, so moving on to a heavy hitter that probably at this point might be the person we brought up the most of any person. Well, maybe with the exception of Christopher Lloyd. But we have brought up Mr. Jerry Goldsmith quite a bit over the course of this podcast. And he composed for this film. So we are bringing him up again. I
SPEAKER_02:really do like the music in this.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, no, it's good.
SPEAKER_02:It's
SPEAKER_01:good. So it maybe has been a minute since we've brought him up, but Jerry Goldsmith, famous composer, amazing person, never... What am I saying?
SPEAKER_02:I don't know.
SPEAKER_01:He has actually won one Oscar, but he's been nominated, was nominated 18 times. I'm glad he got the one, but... So one thing that's really interesting since the last time we've brought up Goldsmith is that I was looking over my previous notes, and at the time, I had written down that he had 256 composing credits. Yeah. But now, don't know what happened, he only has 254.
SPEAKER_02:Someone has robbed this man.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, and I don't know why, but I... Don't know if I'd ever even be able to figure out why or what they took away. I mean, when you're looking at over 250 credits, I'm not going to be able to distinguish which ones are no longer
SPEAKER_02:there. So... Call to action. If someone could let us know which two
SPEAKER_01:were... Exactly, are missing.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:But I'm going to... It has been a minute since we've talked about him, so I'm going to go over... I have a lot of credits for him, but I'm going to go over... Especially earlier in his career, he had a ton of... Oscar nominations. So here we go. He got a Best Original Score nomination for a film called... it's um oh my gosh the guys the
SPEAKER_02:it's easy for you to say
SPEAKER_01:no it's not easy for me to say i want to say fraud and it's not fraud but i'm looking at it um
SPEAKER_02:frog like frog
SPEAKER_01:no no no the psychologist um freud freud okay my brain was not allowing me to say freud so
SPEAKER_02:dr sigman fraud yeah
SPEAKER_01:i don't Why is it not allowing me to say this word? But he got a nom for that. He got another Oscar nomination for A Patch of Blue. I don't know a couple of these films. I do know The Sand Pebbles, so he got a nomination for that. He worked a lot on The Planet of the Apes, so he got an original score nom for the original film, Planet of the Apes. He also, not a nomination, but he also worked on Escape from the Planet of the Apes.
SPEAKER_02:I don't even know which one that is. There's a lot of them. I think the second one is Beneath, so I don't know where Escape lies.
SPEAKER_01:He got another nom. Now, just to be clear, he does finally win. He had a total of 18 Oscar nominations over the course of his career, and he got one. And I think it's going to be really interesting when you, if you don't remember which one he actually wins for. I
SPEAKER_02:do not.
SPEAKER_01:But he gets a nom for Patton. Okay. He gets a nom for Papillion. Okay. He gets a nomination for Chinatown, but doesn't win. But he gets a nom for that. He gets another nom for The Wind in the Line. And now here we go. He gets a nomination and does win for Best Original Score for The Omen.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, okay. That's kind of interesting for...
SPEAKER_01:A horror movie to win anything, honestly. And if I'm being really honest, The Omen is not a film whose score immediately comes to mind. Like, obviously things like The Exorcist. Although that's more so Tubular Bells, which I don't, Like, that was, I think, its own song or what have you before that film even came along. So I don't know if you can consider that score, strictly speaking.
SPEAKER_02:That's fair.
SPEAKER_01:But, like, Poltergeist, obviously, like Halloween. Like, there are certain horror scores that are absolutely iconic. I can't really remember what the omen is off the top of my head. I haven't
SPEAKER_02:seen it that much. I mean, it's not one of my favorite horror movies.
SPEAKER_01:And we were just talking about the name Damien.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, because there's, like, Father Damien Karras in The Exorcist. In The Exorcist. And then... Damien, which was, you know, originally they were going to name the kid after the kid of someone the writer, the creator knew because he thought the kid was a monster. But instead he changed it to just like the name of like a philanthropist.
SPEAKER_01:Oh, okay.
SPEAKER_02:Philanthropist. I don't know why I said it like that. That's
SPEAKER_01:okay. I've been messing up words. And then he also got a Best Original Song award. Oscar nom for The Omen. Okay. Which I'm not sure what that would have been. He also worked on, and I don't know to what degree, I don't know if just they were like, well, we're going to, of course, use the same score for the second film, but he has a credit for Damien colon Omen 2. He also has a... So the best original song, I think that's the only one that was a song nomination. The rest are all scores. So he has a nomination for The Boys from Brazil. No nomination for this, but he did compose on the original Alien film.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, interesting. That's right. I think I do know that.
SPEAKER_01:Yep.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:He got another nomination for the original Star Trek The Motion Picture.
SPEAKER_02:Great movie, except that it's not... Oh. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:So here we go. Now we're getting into the 80s and the films, a lot of the films that we've already covered that he was a part of. So he was the composer for the original Poltergeist. He did compose for The Secret of NIMH. We also covered Twilight Zone, the movie. So just encourage everybody for the films that we covered, go check those earlier episodes out. He gets another Oscar nomination for, we haven't done this one, Under Fire. He also did Gremlins, which we did... Gosh, was that... That was all the way back in season one, I think, even. Was it
SPEAKER_02:really?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Wow. So go check that one out. And then he also has a credit for the sequel, The New Batch. He worked on Supergirl. He did this film, too. He also composed for Baby, Secret of the Lost Legend. He did... So... Okay, so we're talking about First Blood, but they brought in his score for... The title I hate the most. Rambo colon First Blood Part 2 as well as Rambo 3. So we did that. Explorers. He has a credit for the director's cut of Legend.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, interesting. Okay.
SPEAKER_01:And I know that that came up with Andrew, who we covered that one with, so go check that out. He also, again, they brought in his score for Poltergeist 2, The Other Side. He gets another Oscar nomination for Hoosiers, which I would like to cover that at some point.
UNKNOWN:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:He did Interspace. And then of the films that we've covered, the last one is The Birbs. So he did that score. This is a fun little tie-in to the really amazing gift we got last night. He did the score for Total Recall.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, he did. And
SPEAKER_01:we got this super cool gift from a great friend.
SPEAKER_02:A VHS copy of the movie with the original slipcover case, I guess. But the movie... The VHS copy is set up with some LED lighting. It's so cool. It's difficult to describe, but amazing
SPEAKER_01:to see. Yes, it's such a fun thing, and we're so grateful for it. He got another, this is an interesting film to get a nomination for, but he got a nomination for Basic Instinct.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_01:And then, and I'm not even done with the nominations. He did First Night. You know that I love that corny
SPEAKER_02:movie. The kiss where they are like, we're going to break our teeth.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, it is a very aggressive kiss. It
SPEAKER_02:is.
SPEAKER_01:And then, of course, he has other Star Trek credits. He did L.A. Confidential, got a nomination for that. And then his final Oscar nomination was for the... original animated mulan but he also oh i love that he did this too he did the 1999 the mummy which we love so much and then on top of all those credits that i brought up over 30 of them he also did a ton of tv really okay mr jerry goldsmith nice okay so moving on to film editing a female editor Excellent. Just saying. Yeah. Joan E. Chapman.
SPEAKER_02:She's one of three women involved, you know. I
SPEAKER_01:know. Because
SPEAKER_02:there's one. It's
SPEAKER_01:all dudes.
SPEAKER_02:Right at the beginning, you're not, I don't think, going to find a credit for her, even though she played a pretty important role in the movie.
SPEAKER_01:For Rambo's, like, emotional and mental health. Yeah. And the information she gives him.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. And then there's... There's a woman behind a desk at the police station who's just kind of there. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:So, yeah, it's going to be an untouchables like all dudes. But so editing Joni Chapman, this was her first editing credit. She has... A total of eight editor credits, so not a lot to pull from. But she was also the editor on Weekend at Bernie's.
SPEAKER_02:Come
SPEAKER_01:on. So she did that.
SPEAKER_02:I would have never expected First Blood to have all these connections with Weekend at Bernie's. There's always something. We always cover a movie, and we find out that so many people were involved. They kind of had these parallel careers. There's always one or two other movies that just constantly comes up. Would have not expected it to be Weekend at Bernie's.
SPEAKER_01:Agreed. She also cut Mannequin Colon on the move.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, the second one.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, the second one. And then this was kind of interesting because she did work on two different Indiana Jones TV shows. So she cut on the Young Indiana Jones Chronicles as well as the Adventures of Young Indiana Jones.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_01:Okay, so we're at the starts of the film. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Who do we got? Who's
SPEAKER_01:in this movie? I'm not going to say disclaimer, but yeah, it's all dudes. And it's actually a fairly short list. It is,
SPEAKER_02:yeah.
SPEAKER_01:The first, of course, is Sylvester Stallone. He plays John Rambo. And like I said, I think it's been a couple seasons since we've talked about him. But as far as, like, strictly speaking, his acting credits go, he is a actor who almost exclusively worked in film until very, very recently. So his credits are really early in his career. The Lords of Flatbush. Capone. Did you ever watch Death Race 2000?
SPEAKER_02:I have not.
SPEAKER_01:It's fun. Is it? Okay. Yeah, it's a fun film. He's in that. And then here we go. So not only did he get a Best Original Screenplay credit for Rocky, he also did get a Best Actor Oscar nomination for it. So all of his... Because he has one writing Oscar nom and two acting Oscar noms. They all connect back to the Rocky franchise. So that's when he got his first Oscar nom in an acting category up until Creed III came out, right?
UNKNOWN:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:So up until that one, he has been a part. Did
SPEAKER_02:it? Yeah, I think it did, right? I think
SPEAKER_01:it did. Jesus Christ. So he's been a part of it. Because that was his franchise. So he was Rocky II, III, IV, V, Rocky Balboa. He gets a Best Supporting Actor Oscar nomination for Creed. And he's also part of Creed II. And then that's it.
UNKNOWN:He's no longer part of that franchise.
SPEAKER_02:Which seems crazy.
SPEAKER_01:It seems insane to me. But I'm not going to go in. I don't know the rabbit hole of like what happened there and why he's not a part of it anymore. I think we did talk about it a little bit with Dave.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I think if like it was it's not that it's some tragedy that he's no longer associated with it. I think they probably could have come up with a better way of like. wrapping up his story and moving on to like Creed, if they're going to kind of like continue on in that universe. So I don't know what the disagreement was over. Right. But you can learn more about that probably on our podcast about Rocky
SPEAKER_01:IV. Yeah, go check it
SPEAKER_02:out. I'm sure there's some more in there.
SPEAKER_01:And then, you know, this franchise. Yeah. So he is, of course, in Rambo First Blood Part II, Rambo III. Rambo. It's just Rambo. Just Rambo. Rambo. Last Blood.
SPEAKER_02:My favorite parody.
SPEAKER_01:Kind of a fun way to
SPEAKER_02:favorite parody of Rambo is got to be the scene in UHF.
SPEAKER_01:Oh, sure.
SPEAKER_02:When Weird Al is like daydreaming that he is Rambo and this Russian soldier is just like firing this machine gun at And you can't tell from the perspective how far away he is. And then it pans out, and he's a foot away just firing. And he just can't hit him. And then he blows him up with a bow and arrow. Which, by the way, he does not use a bow and arrow until all the sequels. He does not use a bow and arrow
SPEAKER_01:in First Blood. Interesting. Okay.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Much less a bow and arrow with explosive arrows.
SPEAKER_01:And we've also covered UHF, so please go check it out. We have, yeah. That one was with Katie. So moving on through his acting credits. So when we were talking about his writing credits, he doesn't necessarily... write on everything he's in, but there are a fair number of films that he's in that he was writing on. Does that make sense? So he is one of the two stars of Rhinestone, the other being Dolly Parton. He is the star of Cobra. He is the star of Over the Top. He also was in Tango and Cash.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, which one was he? I can't remember.
SPEAKER_01:I'm
SPEAKER_02:going to say he's Cash.
SPEAKER_01:I was going to say he's Tango. Oh my
SPEAKER_02:God.
SPEAKER_01:But you're probably right. I
SPEAKER_02:don't know.
SPEAKER_01:I don't know that movie that well. Oscar, this one, stop or my mom will shoot.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Amazing that that got greenlit.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. There's a sequel, right?
SPEAKER_01:Is there? I
SPEAKER_02:don't know. I think maybe there should
SPEAKER_01:be. Also with Estelle Getty? Oh, I don't know. I don't know. He is the star of Cliffhanger. which has a completely unhinged performance by John Lithgow. Oh, my God.
SPEAKER_02:It's
SPEAKER_01:amazing. It is
SPEAKER_02:the best. He's so crazy in that.
SPEAKER_01:He's completely unhinged. He is the star of Demolition Man, The Specialist, the original Judge Dredd. This is what I was mentioning. So, like, all these films so far, yeah, there's a couple comedies in there, but for the most part, heavy action, maybe a tiny bit of adventure. But then he does Copland, which... he didn't get a nomination for, but I know that a lot of people talked about how great that performance was.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:It was pretty much straight drama.
SPEAKER_02:Exactly. Yeah. He was great in it. It was a good movie. It was different for sure. Can given his history up to that point. So I think he probably should have at least got a nom.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I don't know what the competition was that year, but he also was in Get Carter. And then here's his other huge franchise. He has been in The Expendables 1, 2, 3, and 4.
SPEAKER_02:Have we seen a single one of those?
SPEAKER_01:Ugh. No.
UNKNOWN:Okay.
SPEAKER_02:I already knew the answer. I appreciate that you gave some suspense there. Maybe we have. No.
SPEAKER_01:I know that we've talked about it, and I've maybe even gone on record on the show to be like, I don't know why we haven't seen it yet, because it sounds like the kind of movies I would want to watch.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:So I don't know. Should
SPEAKER_02:we watch that or another season of Project Runway?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I know. he is in these movies I know we haven't watched the third but he's in Guardians of the Galaxy volume 2 and 3
SPEAKER_02:oh yeah he's one of the like the outlaws
SPEAKER_01:kind of
SPEAKER_02:yeah he's like the I don't know if he's like the head of all of these like
SPEAKER_01:I'm gonna be real honest I barely remember anything about 2 except for Ego
SPEAKER_02:oh yeah
SPEAKER_01:and that now is so funny to me because that's Kurt Russell so it's like a weird reunion of Tango and Cash
SPEAKER_02:Kirk Douglas?
SPEAKER_01:No.
SPEAKER_02:See, it's confusing because Kirk Douglas was involved in First Blood. He's not in it, but he almost was.
SPEAKER_01:Oh, I didn't know that.
SPEAKER_02:So we'll get to that.
SPEAKER_01:Okay. You got some fun facts up your sleeve? I do, yeah. Okay. So he's in those. And then, you know, I mentioned when I first was talking about all those credits, almost exclusively film, but most recently he's been part of the TV series Tulsa King.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, yeah. I've seen... I don't know, commercials for that. Okay. Seems very dramatic from what the marketing has put out.
SPEAKER_01:I think, is he kind of like a mafia figure? I don't know.
SPEAKER_02:He's like a king. Oh,
SPEAKER_01:okay. In Tulsa? Yeah. Okay. So I am reworking the way that IMDb listed out the credits because I think the second lead is Brian Dennehy.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:They have Richard Crenna, which, no disrespect... One liner
SPEAKER_02:after one liner the
SPEAKER_01:whole movie. We'll get to him very quickly. But I did want to bring up first Brian Dennehy. Teasel. Teasel. So he is the asshole cop or sheriff, I should say, who from the jump is just so mean to Rambo.
SPEAKER_02:He's kind of a dick.
SPEAKER_01:He's a real dick.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:And...
SPEAKER_02:Classic Dennehy. I
SPEAKER_01:mean, okay, so... This brings up what you were talking about at the top of the episode in terms of what this story is about. And I guess to some degree, I knew that there was tension between maybe the American public and Vietnam vets. I'm going off the presumption that this film is pretty accurately depicting the degree to which vets were discriminated against, even though... The truth of the matter is that they were forced to participate in an award they probably didn't want to participate in at all. Yeah. And had, if not their lives taken from them, had their lives ruined in a lot of ways and then came back to a country that did not appreciate the sacrifices they made.
SPEAKER_02:Was it the last time there was an actual, like, draft? I'm not sure, but I think you definitely have to look at how he was treated based on the fact that he had his army jacket on and he's going through this small town in Washington. Looking at that through the lens of that time,
SPEAKER_01:it's
SPEAKER_02:probably difficult to appreciate it the same way now. but there was a time when everything wasn't, when there wasn't as much of a marketing push and there wasn't the same level
SPEAKER_01:of appreciation. Because things have swung in a very different direction nowadays.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, no one is going to walk up to him back then and say, thank you for your service. That's not what was going to happen. So this may have been almost in terms of a lot of 80s movies where there's almost these comically evil villains in the 80s movies. That's kind of what Teasel, represented
SPEAKER_01:and I guess it was just like my naivete showing when we were watching it because like the truth is that I had never seen this film start to finish I'd only seen bits and pieces and so I was really taken aback
SPEAKER_02:it's it's so yeah they go they go pretty hard into being like the second
SPEAKER_01:he sees so mean to him they're so mean to him and so Brian Dennehy heads up this whole you know cop force and here's what's interesting about Dennehy so he was born he's no longer with us unfortunately a lot of the people who are in this film a number of them are no longer with us Dennehy was born in 1938 he didn't have his first acting credit until 1977
SPEAKER_02:wow
SPEAKER_01:So I'm kind of curious what his life was before. I mean, I guess maybe he was doing more stage work, potentially? Because that wouldn't be noted on IMDb. But I was like, oh, that's so interesting that he didn't have his first IMDb credit until he was almost 40.
SPEAKER_02:That is interesting.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Wow. In any case, so among his credits, mostly films I have for him and... Again, because his first credit was in 77, a lot of these don't feel so long ago. It was in the film.
SPEAKER_02:And yet they
SPEAKER_01:really are. And yet they are, kind of. He's in the movie 10, the one with Dudley Moore and Bo Derek. He was in... Oh, my gosh. I feel like I've brought this up before. Have I brought up before Never Cry Wolf?
SPEAKER_02:I don't know.
SPEAKER_01:Oh, my goodness. I... My dad was amazing, but he made me watch this movie when I was just a little kid. It is not a child-friendly movie. Okay. And it's about this researcher- who I think, like he basically goes out into the wilderness and is completely isolated because he's like studying
SPEAKER_02:wolves. Oh, I have seen that. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:It is, like I remember just being like, oh, this movie is the worst because I was like five and my dad was making me watch it. It's not a
SPEAKER_02:lot to keep your attention.
SPEAKER_01:No.
SPEAKER_02:It's asking a lot of a five-year-old.
SPEAKER_01:I was just like, even at five I was like, dad, this is not an appropriate film for me. Okay. It's not a,
SPEAKER_02:I don't know if It's like necessarily, you know, it's like
SPEAKER_01:it is not a film that is going to keep the attention of a five year old. Yeah, yeah. So that
SPEAKER_02:is true.
SPEAKER_01:So Dennehy, he's also in Gorky Park, Cocoon.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Silverado. Mm
SPEAKER_02:hmm. Good movies. All these
SPEAKER_01:legal eagles return to Snowy River. We watched this. It doesn't feel that long ago, but it's probably closer to the new year. Presumed Innocent.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Tommy Boy. So he's done comedy. I want to say he's Juliet's father in Romeo and Juliet, the one with Leonardo DiCaprio and Claire Danes. Oh,
SPEAKER_02:okay, okay.
SPEAKER_01:So he did do some television work. He was on a show called The Fighting Fitzgeralds. He was in the film Assault on Precinct 13. I included this for you. I don't know. What is it? You know what it is. What is it?
SPEAKER_02:It's Django from Ratatouille.
SPEAKER_01:There you go. So which character was that?
SPEAKER_02:He's like the dad. The rat dad? He's the leader of the rat pack, I guess. Got it. Okay. Yeah, rat colony. He's, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:So he was in that. And then the last credit, I mean, he was in so much TV, like one-offs, two-offs, that kind of thing. But also, he did have a stint on the TV show The Blacklist.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, really? Okay.
SPEAKER_01:Okay, so moving on to Richard Crona. He's Troutman, and he is Rambo's former... What would be the rank? Like, how would you describe the relationship? Like, superior?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, wasn't he Colonel?
SPEAKER_01:Colonel? Colonel Troutman, I
SPEAKER_02:think.
SPEAKER_01:Okay.
SPEAKER_02:He was different. They changed the rank between the movie and the book for no reason. They did the same thing with Dennehy's character. Oh. From, like, county sheriff to just, like, town police captain.
SPEAKER_01:Okay. And, yeah, Troutman, he's an interesting figure.
UNKNOWN:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:I mean, saying he's like a dad figure to Rambo, I think is pushing it. But he is the only one that really kind of understands him.
SPEAKER_02:Because as he says, God didn't make John Rambo. I did.
SPEAKER_01:Great one-liners.
SPEAKER_02:He had so many. Hey, what are you going to need if you bring in all those extra men? Good supply of body bags. Good
SPEAKER_01:supply of body bags. So he comes in. Because, and I wonder how he, how do you think he became aware of what was happening in Hope, Washington? What do you think happened that they're like, hey, Troutman,
SPEAKER_02:your
SPEAKER_01:guy's gone rogue?
SPEAKER_02:When they identified him, and I think David Caruso's character mentions, or he's involved when they identify who Rambo is. He's like a green, ex-Green Beret war hero. And I think in connection with that, they... somehow alerted Trowman or that department became aware that one of theirs was involved in this crazy stuff.
SPEAKER_01:And the other thing that I thought was just so weird, so like maybe this again is just showing my lack of knowledge with this like world, but it seemed like there was just so much hostility between the police force and the military.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, you know, in all these things, they're like, don't give me that jurisdiction garbage.
SPEAKER_01:It was like right out of The Fugitive, or The Fugitive ripped that off.
SPEAKER_02:Always arguing about jurisdiction. It
SPEAKER_01:just was really interesting, because to me, I'm like, you guys are all kind of the same. But it seemed like the law enforcement officials and the military were not friendly to each other.
SPEAKER_02:They're not the same, I would say.
SPEAKER_01:Well, they both kind of...
SPEAKER_02:The soldiers, the army and military ostensibly are there to serve the country and protect the country and the police are not there to do that same thing. One could say if they were so inclined or jaded that the police are there primarily to protect the interests of the wealthy citizens of Hope, Washington that just want to keep the town nice and quiet.
SPEAKER_01:They certainly, as far as L.A. is concerned, don't do jack about the legal fireworks on the 4th of July. No, they
SPEAKER_02:don't. Richard Crenna, I just want to let me know when I can bring up the parallel with Richard Crenna. Not the parallel, but that's how Kirk Douglas was involved.
SPEAKER_01:Oh, well, then bring it up now.
SPEAKER_02:He was going to play that role.
SPEAKER_01:Oh, I didn't know that.
SPEAKER_02:And he insisted. He walked up to Stallone and said, here's what I want. Here's the quote. Here's what I want. At the end of the movie, I should kill you. The audience sees a cop car driving away, and as it disappears into the fog, a hand reaches up to the rearview mirror. The camera turns up, and we see me. It turns up a bit higher, and I'm wearing your headband. That idea was immediately rejected, and Douglas then informed his agent he would be leaving the production. So they brought in Richard Crenna so quickly that he had to have his lines fed to him for the first scene.
SPEAKER_01:Oh, wow. He did a great job. He
SPEAKER_02:did, right?
SPEAKER_01:So Kirk Douglas wanted to take up the mantle of Rambo? Or that was like a souvenir from his kill? I
SPEAKER_02:don't know, but it is interesting because maybe Douglas actually read the book because, you know, he would be killing him. They didn't like that ending generally. They also had a possible ending where Rambo shoots himself in the head
SPEAKER_01:that
SPEAKER_02:tested quite poorly.
SPEAKER_01:Well, I think that would have been... too close to the truth well i think of what some vets yeah
SPEAKER_02:i mean stallone wanted to get that um that monologue out at the end he thought it was really important right and so they were able to um between either of the potential ways that he would be killed at the end and him being able to like get out what he was holding inside all that time with stories that were actually like real stories yeah that he like mixed in um that was probably the right way to go i
SPEAKER_01:think so
SPEAKER_02:yeah sorry sorry uh memory of kirk douglas
SPEAKER_01:so krena going through and he's also unfortunately an actor who's no longer with us but his credits also a mix of film and television so he was in the film the pride of st louis this was interesting so he he had actually a couple really Hmm. Hmm. He was also on a TV show called Slattery's People. Again, I don't know these shows, but he was in the film The Sand Pebbles. Another TV show, All's Fair. This one I would like to do at some point. He's in the 1980 Death Ship.
SPEAKER_02:Death Ship?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Okay, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:I'd like to do that. He's in Body Heat. He comes back for Rambo First Blood Part 2 as well as Rambo 3.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, so at the end of First Blood, he goes to jail. because someone did die, and he did, again, as we mentioned previously, destroy almost a complete town. So he's, I think, four years into his prison sentence when Troutman shows up. So he just, he witnessed the impact of all this trauma. And so he's like, hey, want to go back to Vietnam and get evidence of POWs? And so that's how Rambo 2, First Blood Part 1, whatever, happens.
SPEAKER_01:So he's also, I love that he goes from like Rambo movies to Summer Rental. Oh my
SPEAKER_02:God. Such a good movie.
SPEAKER_01:Summer Rental. He also, so I, I'm sure some people would be like, oh. I don't know Hotshot's part do that well. Does he do a spoof of his character? Because isn't that
SPEAKER_02:movie
SPEAKER_01:partly spoof Rambo?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I don't know, but I think so, yeah. So he must. Now I've got to watch that.
SPEAKER_01:That would be amazing if that was what happened. He was in the movie Jade, also the remake of Sabrina. And then towards the end of his career, he was on the TV show Judging Amy.
UNKNOWN:Hmm.
SPEAKER_01:Okay, so moving on to... Now, as far as who I have left here, there are so many guys in uniform, and a lot of them, I'm sorry, are pretty... They are? Not distinctive. So, like, it's hard to cipher out, like, who's who. There are a couple characters, though, and the first of which is Galt. So Galt is the cop... who is the older cop who ostensibly is the biggest asshole of them all. He
SPEAKER_02:really is.
SPEAKER_01:He is such a jerk. Why he has such a pronounced southern drawl living in Hope, Washington, I don't know. But he... So played by Jack Starrett. And he is just a... He is just an asshole from the jump to Rambo. He has not... I mean, he's also kind of a caricature. Like, he has... No arc. There's no dimension to this guy. He's just immediately, like, hateful to Rambo. And even, I mean, way worse than Dennehy's character, even. Like, Dennehy has to tell him repeatedly, like, cool it.
SPEAKER_02:This is Galt, right? Yeah, yeah, Galt. He very much is. He's, like, Dennehy is way out of line. But he doesn't become as physically abusive, I guess. He doesn't cross that line in the way that Galt does gleefully.
SPEAKER_01:Yes. He takes joy in it. He
SPEAKER_02:is a sociopath.
SPEAKER_01:Yes.
SPEAKER_02:Again, another interesting thing about seeing police behavior like this in the 80s and thinking, wow, they would never act
SPEAKER_01:like that. When they make Rambo take off his shirt, it's very clear that he was physically abused. He's been whipped. Yes. During his time. It does not even phase Galt at all like Mitch we'll get to Crusoe in a second it's like oh my god we should tell
SPEAKER_02:Teasel about this
SPEAKER_01:yeah yeah and anyway so Jack Starrett you know he was a little bit older when he was already cast in this role so his career um he had a lot of his career before this movie came along some of his credits are really interesting it's like the same play on a couple words. Like, he was in a film called Hell's Angels on Wheels.
SPEAKER_02:Uh-huh,
SPEAKER_01:uh-huh. But then he was also in a film called Angels from Hell.
SPEAKER_02:On Wheels? No,
SPEAKER_01:but... I was like, well, that's interesting. And then he also was in a film called The Born Losers, as well as a film just called The Losers. So I thought
SPEAKER_02:that
SPEAKER_01:it was just really interesting. He was in these movies. He was also in a film called Hell's Bloody Devils.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, okay. Sounds interesting, actually. All super fun titles.
SPEAKER_01:Now, I don't know this film really well because it's not totally my humor, but he is in Blazing Saddles. I don't know who he is in Blazing Saddles.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I'd have to watch it again. That movie... Oh, my God. Right. People are like, they would never make The Office nowadays. Blazing
SPEAKER_01:Saddles is like hold my beer he was in the film The Rose with Bette Midler I do want to do this film too at some point because there's weirdly a lot of now famous actors in it Grizzly 2 Revenge he's in that
SPEAKER_02:I'm in I'm in yeah
SPEAKER_01:and then he's no he's no longer with us his final credit was in 1990 and it was Hollywood Heartbreak
SPEAKER_02:okay
SPEAKER_01:so okay so the the other person I just mentioned Mitch so he also is part of the cop crew let's just tell gonna refer to them played by David Caruso
SPEAKER_02:yeah
SPEAKER_01:and funny because nowadays David Caruso is known for like kind of like gravelly voice that he has and he's like a high-pitched kind of pipsqueak in this movie like he
SPEAKER_02:he really is I mean he he is probably the most junior of the cops on that yeah that particular force his yeah He gets kind of beat up a little bit by it. Everyone at some point has a turn at knocking him back.
SPEAKER_01:He's the only one I only felt bad about when Rambo... He was kind of a
SPEAKER_02:voice of reason.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. He was the only one that showed any compassion whatsoever. Or just, yeah, voice of reason towards this whole situation. And Caruso, you know, really interesting because... He doesn't have a credit for more than the last 10 years. So I'm not quite sure what he's been up to lately. Just
SPEAKER_02:dramatically taking his sunglasses
SPEAKER_01:on and off. I know. That's become such a thing with him. So among his credits really early in his career, he was in An Officer and a Gentleman. He actually did. I don't know if it's because of his connection, maybe, with one of the writers or maybe it's just coincidence. He was on Hill Street Blues a couple times. He was in the film Twins.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_01:With Schwarzenegger and DeVito. King of New York, Hudson Hawk. Oh,
SPEAKER_02:wow. Hudson Hawk. That's a name I haven't heard of in a long while. Wow.
SPEAKER_01:So, of course, the show that really brought him his initial notoriety was NYPD Blue.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:And, you know, I think a lot of people are probably familiar with NYPD. what has been publicly told. Who knows what really happened behind the scenes. But the way that I always remembered it is that he got really popular really fast, didn't want to be tied down to this TV show,
SPEAKER_02:thought
SPEAKER_01:that there were probably better options out there for him acting-wise, and left the show. Well,
SPEAKER_02:I mean, it worked out, didn't it?
SPEAKER_01:Exactly. So, like, well, no. Were you joking or are you being serious?
SPEAKER_02:Well, it's unlike... Five billion episodes of CSI, right? Well,
SPEAKER_01:so that's the thing, is that he wanted to be a movie star.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, well then it didn't work out.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_01:And two of the more arguably well-known films that he was in after leaving NYPD Blue were Kiss of Death and Jade.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:And things weren't exactly playing out, I think, the way he had maybe envisioned they would. Okay. And so he does come back to television. And yes, to your point, he was the headliner of CSI Miami for an entire decade.
SPEAKER_02:What a tragedy that he continued to have... basically like success for years, but it was through the format of television.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. So like, I don't want to like go too hard on that point because who knows? No, of course
SPEAKER_02:we love David Caruso.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Like I, I mean, what, I don't know. I don't know the guy. Okay. He's kind of an asshole. I only know what was told through, you know, fucking Entertainment Tonight and all that kind of bullshit. Oh, well, I
SPEAKER_02:don't believe them,
SPEAKER_01:so I think I'm back on his side. Yeah, I don't know. Who knows? Who knows what really happened? But that is David Caruso.
SPEAKER_02:I got one more guy that we gotta bring up. Oh, I have a couple more guys. You do? Yeah. Oh, my God, please.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I have two more guys. So one is the Officer Ward.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_01:Okay, so to try to differentiate who he is, he is the other younger-ish guy Officer, who when Rambo first comes in, there's like three guys that are handling him. Gault, Mitch, and Ward.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_01:And Ward is like, he's taller, he's thin, dark hair, and he's not nearly as bad as Gault, but he's more than willing to go along with what Gault was doing.
SPEAKER_02:Yes.
SPEAKER_01:So that's who Ward is, played by Chris Mulkey.
UNKNOWN:Okay.
SPEAKER_02:Who you will totally recognize.
SPEAKER_01:Well, that's what I'm saying. This guy is insane. Yeah. So far he has 267 acting credits, 13 upcoming. Like the guy is a machine. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:You'll recognize him and you won't be able to tell exactly where you recognize him from because he's in everything.
SPEAKER_01:He's in everything. Yeah. I mean, not always like a super high profile role. But he's there. But he's there. He's like, where's Waldo? Yeah. I have like over 20 credits for him. Cause like, Oh, he's in this and he's in this. And he, he moves pretty smoothly between television and film. So some of the credits I have for him, like fairly early in his career, he's in time writer, the adventure of Lyle Swan. He plays a lot of cops. He plays the credit is second cop in 48 hours. So he's in that. He's in dreamscape. I think. Oh
SPEAKER_02:yeah. Another one we're going to cover for sure.
SPEAKER_01:I think there is probably almost certainly a, fan base that knows him from being on the TV show Twin Peaks
SPEAKER_02:oh probably yeah
SPEAKER_01:so he played a character I don't really know that world very well but he played a character called Hank Jennings so he was on the original TV show for that he was in Gas Food Lodging Broken Arrow The Fan he plays cop number two in Bullworth so
SPEAKER_02:he's in that cop number
SPEAKER_01:two so some TV work he was on a TV show called Any Day Now I thought this was fun it's just one episode so I normally wouldn't call it out but he was on csi miami
SPEAKER_02:amazing
SPEAKER_01:so he reteams with caruso on that he was on the tv show for a while friday night lights he's in the film cloverfield
SPEAKER_02:oh really
SPEAKER_01:yeah he's like a military guy so i want to say he might be somebody the kids were interacting with at the very end
SPEAKER_02:you're not going to be able to see him though because of the camera shake
SPEAKER_01:so he and here's what's funny not only is he in csi miami he like really is in the csi world he's also um or he was Which, this is so redundant, CSI crime scene investigation. But he was on that. He also was on, and I do remember that I said it kind of funny last time, but he was on CSI Cyber.
SPEAKER_02:How'd you say it before?
SPEAKER_01:How'd you say it was funny? I don't know. I was like cyber or something like that. But anyway, so he's on all these different CSIs is my point. He was on the TV show Boardwalk Empire. And then a couple films. Collapse of the Living Dead, which I did not know that. The Purge. So he's doing some horror.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_01:Captain Phillips.
SPEAKER_02:He's the captain now. No, he is not. He's not that guy, no.
SPEAKER_01:Also, Whiplash.
SPEAKER_02:Really? Yeah,
SPEAKER_01:I think he plays the kid's uncle or something. More TV work, he was on Grimm. And just in general, so much television. Even
SPEAKER_02:one episode of Knight Rider.
SPEAKER_01:There you go.
SPEAKER_02:And Magnum P.I.
SPEAKER_01:And then a couple more films I have for him, Gotti and On the Basis of Sex. Okay. All right, so here's the last person I have. You're welcome to bring up anyone else. And I almost, not to be super rude, I was almost going to leave him off because I don't...
SPEAKER_02:Gotta do what you gotta do.
SPEAKER_01:So this is the cop that like, I don't really remember him much in the precinct. Like when Rambo first gets pulled in. But he is part of the crew that's like actively going after him in the forest.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_01:And all I can say is that he is the cop that has like a little bit of a fuller face. Like he's got some cheeks. Like I don't know what else to say about him. But his character name is Balford.
SPEAKER_02:Balford?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_01:That's all I can tell you here.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_01:I just remember they did cut away to multiple shots of him. And I knew that he was somebody that I had not seen yet. But I don't know if he really does anything that's like plot changing for the film.
SPEAKER_02:Got it. I know you're talking about. Okay.
SPEAKER_01:And then among his credits, we have almost all film. I would be really curious to know who he is in Carrie. We can't cover that film, but I'd like to know who he is in Carrie.
UNKNOWN:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:This is interesting. So he was in the film Used Cars, and then there was a TV movie version of Used Cars that he's also in.
SPEAKER_02:That is interesting.
SPEAKER_01:Wow. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_01:Any Which Way You Can. Oh,
SPEAKER_02:those movies with Clint Eastwood and an orangutan.
SPEAKER_01:Mommy Dearest, Vacation, Manhunter, and Hero.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, Manhunter was like the Silence of the Lambs prequel, right? Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. So that's what I have for Michael Talbot.
SPEAKER_02:OK, so I just want to give a quick shout out to Alf Humphreys.
SPEAKER_01:Yes, I debated including him.
SPEAKER_02:Well, he played Lester and we have covered him in My Bloody Valentine. Yes, he was Howard, I think, in that. And the reason I wanted to bring him up is because his character, Lester, has like a bandage over his nose. That's him. That's him. And that's because Stallone in real life broke his nose with his elbow during the like the escape scene. sequence,
SPEAKER_01:I think. Oh, I didn't know you really did it.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, he really broke his nose, so yeah, he was bandaged up for the rest of it.
SPEAKER_01:Okay. I did debate, because I did recognize the name from my bloody valentine, but... Okay, film synopsis.
SPEAKER_02:What do we got? It should be fairly straightforward.
SPEAKER_01:A veteran Green Beret is forced by a cruel sheriff and his deputies to flee into the mountains and wage an escalating one-man war against his pursuers. Sure. I think it's a great one.
SPEAKER_02:I'm glad they added cruel.
SPEAKER_01:Yes.
SPEAKER_02:To Sheriff.
SPEAKER_01:Yes.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. No. That works. That works for me. Totally
SPEAKER_01:works for me. Yeah. Totally works for me. I mean, I'm very curious because I don't think I have asked you this.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:When did you first see this movie?
SPEAKER_02:I don't know when I saw the first one, but I was probably more aware of the sequels, actually. And it was never something that I was really into as a kid. I remember seeing Rambo 3 and just thinking there was so much momentum for that when it came out. So I saw it in the theater, and I'm like, ah, this is kind of ridiculous. I think I could watch it now and have a different... perspective on it. Like I wouldn't, I wouldn't even try to take it seriously. Sure. Because it's just so over the top, which not to be confused with the actual movie over the top, but I saw first blood, uh, Probably after a lot of those other movies were released. And I don't think I even realized what it was when I first saw it. I probably saw it just on cable or something. And got interested in this survival fight that he was in. And so kind of sought it out to watch the whole thing. And was really impressed with it. And was just kind of perplexed as to how... this movie gets you to some of the other ones. I mean, the answer is probably always money. Like they were able to pitch that and just turn it into this like kind of wild over the top violence laden franchise. But yeah, I saw it. It's not like some of the movies that we cover where I like distinctly remember seeing it in the theaters and have all these, like, you know, I remember seeing it with my dad or something. Cause my dad, wasn't a big fan of any of the Rambo movies from first blood on. But I saw it a little bit later and just kind of appreciated that it was at least trying to put a little bit of a different message in.
SPEAKER_01:Well, if you even look, like, as of right now, if you look at the key art for the film on IMDb, because at first I was like, this must have been mocked up maybe after the fact, because he does look a little bit, like, hyper... stylized in a way that I don't think is reflected in the film. Like with it being more of a, I don't know, I guess I was going to say like a lower key performance of him and not like the Rambo films that came afterwards.
SPEAKER_02:No, it's not, it's not like his performance. I don't think at least in the other Rambos. And I've, like I said, I've seen three, I've probably seen parts of two. They just seem very different from like a tonal perspective of, And it's also, I'm glad that he has an interaction with one of his buddies' mom. Moms? Yeah. In
SPEAKER_01:the beginning. Oh, was that the mom? I don't know. I thought it was like a spouse or a partner. Yeah,
SPEAKER_02:I'm not sure. But I just appreciated that because you get to see Stallone acting in a different way from what you would have been used to. Because he's not Rocky. Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:I mean, I remember you saying that. Yeah. Like, he... is talking normally. It's
SPEAKER_02:the happiest you see him in the entire
SPEAKER_01:movie. Yeah, it is.
SPEAKER_02:Because he thinks he's going to be able to reunite with someone who would... he'd be able to talk to and share like some of these experiences I've had.
SPEAKER_01:It's really interesting though. The one thing that is in common with Rocky and by the way, just one last thing about the key art, which I was like,
SPEAKER_02:is it the one where he's got like the M 60 and the, yeah, it's
SPEAKER_01:under his name. It says this time he's fighting for his life. So obviously a,
SPEAKER_02:it's a play on Rocky, isn't it? I mean,
SPEAKER_01:yeah. Yeah. Um, Which I thought was interesting that they pulled from that. But in any case, yeah, to your point... I
SPEAKER_02:mean, I'm sure he would have had to approve. I
SPEAKER_01:would think so, yeah. You're absolutely right. It is the happiest that we see him in the entire film. And the one thing that I do think he has in common with the Rocky character is when he's approaching that woman and he's talking to her, there's kind of a... What's the word I'm... Like kind of like a, not submissive, but he's just very gentle. Yeah. And like very kind of like, hey, I just wanted to see where my friend was. And he's that way in Rocky too. Yeah. Like he's a very gentle person actually.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:And so I thought that that was interesting that that carries over into this film. But then it very quickly like turns on a dime because he has to. Like, cause yeah, he is fighting for his life. They just
SPEAKER_02:kept pushing him. All he wanted was a meal.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. And that made me so sad, too. When when then he picks him up and he's like asking where he can get a bite to eat. And he's like, oh, there's a place 30 miles outside of here. I was like, oh, my God, it's
SPEAKER_02:so rude. It's a pretty like tight movie timing wise. Like it is it is so over the top the way that they like the police react to him and treat him. But it it gets through that pretty quickly. Like he's he's like walking, finds out that his buddies died. is kind of approached by Dennehy's character and told to get the fuck out of town and not come back. arrested in jail they try to shave him and then the movie like really starts like moving as soon as he like breaks out and does that pretty fantastic like juked out the guy in the dirt bike move yeah
SPEAKER_01:i felt that for him i was like oh he probably got real hurt getting thrown from that bike but i i do agree with you the film really picks up although for me the first half of the film is far more interesting than the second half because like once once Galt dies. Yeah. And maybe a little bit of change, like maybe 10 minutes beyond that. But then once he like, basically like he gets kind of trapped. They
SPEAKER_02:pull in the entire U S army to
SPEAKER_01:track him down. And like Troutman is super interesting. I love his addition to the film, but like what is actually happening gets like a little bit, even as tight as that film is where it's like barely over 90 minutes.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:It, it, The sequence of him being in the cave is not as interesting to me because then it becomes more of a Troutman and what is his name? Teasel?
SPEAKER_02:Teasel, yeah. They show the two of them interacting and then it cuts back to... uh, Stallone, because at that point, everyone thinks that Stallone has been killed by the fucking rocket launcher. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:And, and don't get me wrong. Like, I think that the interactions between Teasel and Trauman are really interesting. It just like the, the action. And I'm not like, I need to be hyped up on action the whole time, but like, yeah, there was just something more compelling to me about the first half of the film.
SPEAKER_02:I thought it was interesting when Teasel thinks they all think that Stallone, that the Rambo has been killed. He's, he's, Trying to be... It's so easy to be apologetic or try to make some amends with Trotman when you basically have gotten what you want. You wanted him killed. You're pretty sure he's dead. So now you can walk in and say, for whatever it's worth, maybe I was a little out of luck. And then as soon as they find out that he's back, he just immediately flips back to piece of shit Teasel.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I mean... The only reason why that character is as compelling as he is is because it's played by Dennehy, because I think if it would have been played by a lesser actor, it would have been just a total caricature. Yeah. I don't like that character. I
SPEAKER_02:don't think you're supposed to. No,
SPEAKER_01:no, no, no. But it is interesting that the only time you're ever on his side is when he's just trying to talk down other guys, namely Gold, who are going even more extreme. You're like, yeah, please talk some reason into him. He's about
SPEAKER_02:to fire his rifle into the crowd. And
SPEAKER_01:just in general, I did... Again, it was an interesting film for me to watch start to finish because I don't really understand what that sentiment was at that time in American history with the Vietnam vets. And I've said this a lot with different films. I don't know if they allude to this since you've seen some of the... I haven't seen any of the other Rambo movies. Not a lick of them. So I don't know if at any point they go more so into his background. Not just his time in Vietnam, but... Oh,
SPEAKER_02:I'm not sure. I think because he is going to Vietnam in Rambo First Blood Part II, I think they probably go into... Flashbacks and stuff. Yeah, I think they do in that one. But it's been... A very long time since I've seen any of the sequels.
SPEAKER_01:Because I guess for me, what I was thinking, especially the very first part of the film, he's walking through his town. It made me really sad that this one person he had a connection with has died. And that's the last of his troop. And I just was curious, like, why is he basically this loner walking around Washington state? Like, does he have any family? Like, where is he originally from? Is he from Washington? Is he not from what? Like, I just had all these questions about like, what was his background that this is what he felt like was the only choice available to him. Yeah. And also, like, how long has he been back in the States? I mean, it's early 80s. It seems like it's set in early 80s. I'm
SPEAKER_02:not sure. I think. Yeah, the timing is interesting because there is, like, another plot point from the book that's not reflected in the movie, which is that Tiesel was actually a vet of the Korean War. Oh. Which apparently had been mostly forgotten versus Rambo.
SPEAKER_01:See, they should have kept that in. That would have been super interesting.
SPEAKER_02:And that was in some way, like... part of the animosity that was,
SPEAKER_01:well, they should have kept that in. Not that that would have made me any more, um, sympathetic necessarily to Tiesel, but that's interesting. That's a really interesting conflict is like a Korean war vet versus a Vietnam vet.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:But I
SPEAKER_02:don't know. I mean, yeah, my, my dad was drafted, but never went overseas. My uncle was, and it was very difficult. He made it back, but, um, Yeah, yeah. So I don't know, other than what I've seen on TV or read about in terms of the sentiment for veterans during that period of time, it is obviously just much different now.
SPEAKER_01:Yes.
SPEAKER_02:The perspective and attitude towards veterans is much different now than it was back then.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. And it did make me really sad for him that he already is somebody who has obviously suffered and then is just almost literally getting spit at. I wouldn't be surprised if at some point one of those characters would have spit at him because of just how much disdain they have for him.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, it's just crazy the sentiment and the tone, the message that is provided, particularly when you get to the very end and... I don't know how people generally responded to the end of the movie in the theaters when you're presented with this obviously not as over the top, God, I keep on saying that, not as crazy action as you have in the sequels, but again, it's like him surviving out in the woods and then coming and single-handedly taking down the town, but then it really gets a little bit more real when he has that breakdown in the monologue. And to see where it went From that ending. To where it went into the sequels. Just. There's like.
SPEAKER_01:It's actually a really heartbreaking scene. Yeah. It's heartbreaking for him. And what he's doing. verbalizing and the emotional like trauma that he's going what has gone through and is going through still i think it's interesting krena played that scene really really well i think yeah yeah you can tell he's also getting emotional but he's still being held back by this like sense of propriety of being in the military and you know stallone grabs him and is just like He just needs some kind of human compassion and contact and comfort. And Troutman, he doesn't pull away, but he doesn't embrace him in the same way. He
SPEAKER_02:doesn't fully open up.
SPEAKER_01:He doesn't fully open up, but I guess as much as he thought he could. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:So all to say, I don't think the sequels necessarily take away anything from the first one. I just kind of think of the first one as it's like, own thing that has more of a message and people clearly really enjoyed the sequels because they kept making them, so they were popular. But I think there's just something a little bit different and special about the first one.
SPEAKER_01:The first one is almost a 70s movie.
SPEAKER_02:It is. It has that look to
SPEAKER_01:it, doesn't it? Yeah, because the rest of the films, even though I'm speaking out of turn because I haven't seen them, but from what I gather, they're much more the testosterone-filled, over-the-top.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, see how easy it is to say it? Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Well, I don't feel bad about saying it. Over the top? Type of film that was very indicative of 80s action.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:So it... But, you know, not maybe on the same scale, but, I mean, even the Rocky franchise kind of does that a little bit.
SPEAKER_02:Big
SPEAKER_01:time, yeah. Yeah, the first one is so different than the rest of
SPEAKER_02:the films. The second one, like, the first two are almost like one long movie of sorts. But then, for sure, once you get to three, it just gets bonkers.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. So, you know, in any case, I'm actually curious to, like, would you watch this film again?
SPEAKER_02:I think so. In fact, I definitely would because when we were getting ready to watch it for this podcast, my options were to rent it for$4 or just buy the 40th anniversary for$10. So I just bought it. Oh,
SPEAKER_01:you did? So now if I want
SPEAKER_02:to watch it again, I will. And there's like some bonus stuff on it probably. So yeah, I'll definitely watch it again.
SPEAKER_01:I think if you were watching it, I probably would sit down with you. You wouldn't
SPEAKER_02:leave the room? I
SPEAKER_01:probably wouldn't leave the room.
SPEAKER_02:That's good.
SPEAKER_01:But that being said, I don't know if it's a film that I would think to watch
SPEAKER_02:again. I don't know that I'd watch it start to finish, but yeah, there are some parts that are
SPEAKER_01:more interesting. Because it's kind of a hard movie to watch in some ways with the way he's treated. Call to Action. I
SPEAKER_02:already gave mine.
SPEAKER_01:You say that. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:What
SPEAKER_01:was it?
SPEAKER_02:I'm still interested in knowing what the two credits were that were taken off of Jerry
SPEAKER_01:Goldsmith. Oh, well, okay.
SPEAKER_02:It counts.
SPEAKER_01:All right. I mean, I'm curious, since we've been talking about it quite a bit, people's feelings on the first film versus the rest of the franchise.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:And if, you know, some people are like... What's the word? Not... Well, there's the term completionist, but then what's the opposite of that? Incompletionist? Well, that's how I am when we're talking about Poltergeist, where I'm like, for me, it's the first film and that's it.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:And there's a handful of other films that have become franchises that I also feel that way about, and I'm just curious people's thoughts on...
SPEAKER_02:Because people obviously like them. They did well. Sure. And
SPEAKER_01:some people, maybe they... Like, for instance, Dave with... rocky and presumably i'd also say halloween minus three because i know he's not he doesn't really include three in the mix but like he embraces all of it yeah he he each of those films he loves for different reasons and so you know we're we're dear listeners what's your take
SPEAKER_02:you know the easy thing when you when you like send him off to vietnam or like you're getting he's not fighting like small town cops he's fighting like ostensibly just quote unquote the enemy right it's really easy to just turn all of his enemies into caricatures so that he can't just like go exactly like you know crazy glorified violence murderous rampage yeah yeah and no one's gonna feel bad about that right they're like oh yeah Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:So if you want to get in touch, we'd love to hear from you. You can reach out through Facebook, Instagram, or Twitter X. It is the same handle at all three at 80s Montage Pod and 80s is 80S. Uh-huh. Okay. I'm fairly certain you don't know what the sneak peek is.
SPEAKER_02:I know it's the end of an episode when you say those words.
SPEAKER_01:Oh, sure. I was like, where are you going with this? Okay. Yes, because I did switch it out.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, from what to what? Because I don't, I probably, did I know either option?
SPEAKER_01:You probably knew one, but I'm going to do this one because we've actually talked about this film a couple of times and I've said like, oh, we should do this. And I'm kind of, we've done a lot, and look, I love all of them, but we've done a lot of like teen flicks and other types of films up through this like kind of first half of the year.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:So this is another film, and actually I think it'd be really interesting to talk about this right now. Let me think of a clue.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_01:Well, if I get... The one thing that came to mind is going to instantly give it away.
SPEAKER_02:Okay. Well, don't give me that clue then, unless you want to instantly give it away.
SPEAKER_01:What could be another clue?
SPEAKER_02:I don't know. I
SPEAKER_01:don't know. I'm just going to give you the clue that's going to give it away. Yeah. Yeah. That's okay. But I got to do it in the voice. Oh. I can't really do it in the voice. Do you want to play a game?
SPEAKER_02:Oh, we're going to do war games.
UNKNOWN:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Okay. Yeah. So... Alternative clues would have been the only way to win is to not play.
SPEAKER_01:But you would have instantly known that. Yeah,
SPEAKER_02:that's true. That's true. But that was because it was my clue, so obviously.
SPEAKER_01:So yeah, I'm... I mean, this is what... So I get into these moods where... You could have just said
SPEAKER_02:Joshua.
SPEAKER_01:Would you have gotten it? I
SPEAKER_02:don't know. That's why it would have been a good clue. Joshua.
SPEAKER_01:Um... I get into these moods where I'll just have a film on. Well, like I'm not watching it. It's just in the background because I know it so well, but I'll just play it as nauseam for like a month at a time.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. I'm always, always happy for another Dabney Coleman movie.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Yeah. It is going to be fun to get to celebrate him again. Yeah. A lot of fun people. I mean, obviously Matthew Broderick and this also precedes Ferris.
SPEAKER_02:Yes.
SPEAKER_01:So it's an interesting look at like his pre Ferris. Yeah,
SPEAKER_02:he's kind of Ferris in this too, but not
SPEAKER_01:quite. He's a little bit Ferris in this role. A little bit more serious. A little bit. Ally Sheedy is also in it. And yeah, Dabney Coleman. And oh my goodness. And
SPEAKER_02:then that one guy that you'll recognize, but not quite sure
SPEAKER_01:what his name is. Well, and they're both in Ladyhawk.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Oh. Because he's.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, the bishop. The evil bishop is the.
SPEAKER_01:And he's like the sweetest guy in this movie. He is. He is. Much nicer. It was his son that he lost. He was a real
SPEAKER_02:asshole in Ladyhawk, let me tell you. He sure was, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:So they're all going to be there. And until then. Okay, bye. Thank you to everyone. With all the podcast choices out there, we really appreciate that you have taken the time to listen to ours. And we will talk to you again in two weeks' time.